Daily Links: It’s back to work we go

  • Salas making a case for a roster spot [Newsday]
  • Small hands, big potential for Amaro [WSJ]
  • 4 things to look for today [Star Ledger]
  • Vintage Vick in scrimmage [NY Post]
  • Cunningham injury has little or no effect on the Jets [Jets Confidential]



134 comments
a57se
a57se

Pryor must have hurt himself pretty bad as he is still in a red non-contact jersey...

NYCPEinGermany
NYCPEinGermany

There was some chatter going on here over the weekend that rather than drafting 12, we should've traded a few picks so we could've picked higher. 


I don't see it that way. It was a ridiculously deep draft and I think the train of thought with the braintrust (not basing my opinion on anything other than common sense, i.e. no proof) was that we should use them all and see who sticks. If we traded a few away and picked higher, there's no guarantee that those players are more likely to stick, as once you get past the first coupla rounds, the draft grades are probably quite similar. I like that on a team with many needs and a great draft class (where many of the deepest positions coincided with what we needed), they decided to use 'em all. If we end up with "too many" good players, that's a nice problem to have and a welcome change. Of course, I can see the logic of trading up as well, but I like how it played out. 


Curious what others think. 

Bent
Bent moderator

@nesboogie Again?  If you're referring to the first "injury" he returned to drills within minutes so that was apparently a false alarm.

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se It can't be *that* bad if he's running around out there though and he was cleared for that pretty early.  Hopefully they're just following the protocols and he'll be ready soon.

juunit
juunit

@nesboogie 

Wait, the Bengals really signed Dalton? Even with the way he's played in every single playoff game?

What is in the water in Ohio?

Bent
Bent moderator

@nesboogie Wow, six years, $115m.


Although when the real details leak, we'll probably learn it's a lot less than that.

Bent
Bent moderator

@NYCPEinGermany As I said at the time, the fact they doubled up on positions was a clear sign they were going to give themselves a chance to pick on the cream of the crop.


With 2 OLBs, 2 CBs and 3 WRs in the mid-late rounds there was always going to be at least one of each that didn't make the roster.  I don't mind the approach either.  Trading up can work, but it can also be a bad move - we all know that.

Ceifus Hornswoggle
Ceifus Hornswoggle

@NYCPEinGermany 

I'm happy they spent all 12 picks.  We need depth and guys who can develop into starters over the next few years.  And there's certainly no guarantee that a guy you traded up for will pan out - either by staying healthy or by making the jump to the NFL.  It's better to spread the risk across as many picks as possible, especially when you get the bumper crop of picks that the Jets had this year.



hitchhiker
hitchhiker

Its amazing how, according to "some," the team went from nearly devoid of talent to having such depth that the team has "too many good players" & there is no room for rookies that are not ready to step in & play at a high level on a team that runs complicated schemes on offense & defense.

a57se
a57se

@Bent @a57se 

Perhaps they are just being super cautious since this is just training camp...9 days since his concussion and not cleared for contact is a bit unusual.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@Bent @nesboogie

This has to be a Kaepernick-type of deal, where they can easily get out from it after a couple of years without massive dead money.  I expect that to be the new baseline type of QB extension.

a57se
a57se

@Bent @nesboogie 

It should be less then that...if not, Cincinnati might have screwed them selves with Dalton.

NYCPEinGermany
NYCPEinGermany

@Bent 

"With 2 OLBs, 2 CBs and 3 WRs in the mid-late rounds there was always going to be at least one of each that didn't make the roster."


True - I could well imagine one or even two of the 3 newly drafted WRs going to the IR with 'something', especially with Salas having a good camp.


(ducks under desk before TSJ can drop a 10 ton weight on my head, Monty Python style). 

NYCPEinGermany
NYCPEinGermany

@tsjc68 @NYCPEinGermany

I enjoy the depth as well. The length of Amaro's hands concerns me (but not much), and I like the width we have across the Dline.

bklyndude
bklyndude

@Ceifus Hornswoggle @NYCPEinGermany

Four of the twelve picks were 6th and 7th round.  Not exactly picks that are in demand around the NFL.

Those picks became potentially nice picks such as: Trevor Reilly, Brandon Dixon and Quincy Enunwa who I would like to see more of.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@Ceifus Hornswoggle @NYCPEinGermany

It's better to spread the risk across as many picks as possible, especially when you get the bumper crop of picks that the Jets had this year.


Repeated for emphasis.


The draft is a crapshoot, and thus, generally speaking, having more lottery tickets is better than having fewer.

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent No, that's about what I'd expect.  Remember when Revis got kicked in the head in the opener?  He missed the next game and then returned the following week.  He had also returned to practice with a red jersey.

Bent
Bent moderator

@tsjc68 @Bent @nesboogie


Per Spotrac:


Andy Dalton signed a 6 year / $115 million contract with the Cincinnati Bengals, including a $2,292,144 signing bonus, $4,028,171 guaranteed, and an annual average salary of $1,303,550.


So...approximately $105m of it is in unlikely to be earned incentives?  Interesting.


http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cincinnati-bengals/andy-dalton/


(Obviously they must be half way through updating the page and some of his rookie details are still included but that's still pretty funny).

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent @nesboogie It will be, definitely.  The $110m, eight year deal for T Smith announced the other day was actually only really a six year, 70m deal.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@Paul Samuels @Bent @NYCPEinGermany

Now that Cunningham is out and Barnes appears ticketed for the PUP, both IK and Reilly have a solid chance of making the team together.


I never anticipated Evans not making the team.  He's good money due to nothing other than draft position.  All six of our R1-R4 picks will make the Week 1 roster.

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent @NYCPEinGermany Yes, I agree what goes on in the first three rounds outweighs the rest of the draft immeasurably.

NYCPEinGermany
NYCPEinGermany

@a57se 


Seems to me like they didn't. Time will tell.

a57se
a57se

@Bent @a57se 

With the resources we had from the 4th round on, we could have gotten almost any player we really wanted in the 2nd and 3rd rounds...we decided to let the Draft come to us. 

a57se
a57se

@NYCPEinGermany 

The picks we made were considered good by a lot of prognosticators (the 1st and 2nd round picks at least) but that means little at this point.


a57se
a57se

@bklyndude @a57se 

Dude, I didn't say the Jets screwed up the first three rounds so calm down!

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent I wouldn't have had a problem with that.  Maybe the players they really wanted were Pryor, Amaro and McDougle?

NYCPEinGermany
NYCPEinGermany

@a57se @NYCPEinGermany

Sure, like I said, time will tell. Acting like there's no reason for optimism is a bit silly, IMO. Especially when talking about being a fan of a pro sport - if you're not going to indulge in a little optimism (some might call it 'fun') then what's the point?

bklyndude
bklyndude

@a57se @bklyndude

what's the point of posting if they don't screw up the first three rounds.........

That's the same for all NFL teams,  isn't it ?

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent @tsjc68 @Paul Samuels


I like him.  Does one of the rookies have more upside?  Yes.  And are they more dynamic?  Sure.


That's where you decide whether your priority is winning now or next year.

a57se
a57se

@Bent @a57se 

With the talent that was available in this draft, I hope we didn't think those were the best players in round 2 and 3...

a57se
a57se

@NYCPEinGermany @a57se 

I wasn't talking about optimisim.

This is the time of year to be optimistic if that is what you need to do...I try and be realistic

a57se
a57se

@bklyndude @a57se 

Because I am not sure they DIDN'T screw up the first three rounds...

Unlike you, I have not made my mind up on this draft class yet.

NYCPEinGermany
NYCPEinGermany

@a57se @NYCPEinGermany

However you most enjoy your sports FANatiscm. I like being realistic, too, but if I see a reason for optimism, I'm all over it!


(Someone else brought up 'optimism' above - sorry that I confused them with you)

bklyndude
bklyndude

@a57se @bklyndude

I don't think anybody can fairly make up their minds on draft picks until at least two full seasons.

You have criticized Idzik for last years picks and seemed to have made up your mind on those picks.

a57se
a57se

@bklyndude @a57se 

My criticism of Idzik and his picks has more to do with his evaluation of talent then the actual picks themselves. I don't think he does a good job of assigning value to players. Because of that, he overdrafts some and misses out on guys he undervalued. He did the same thing in Free Agency in my opinion.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@bklyndude @a57se

And while he claims he hasn't made up his mind on this draft class yet, he's also been exceedingly critical of it.

Ceifus Hornswoggle
Ceifus Hornswoggle

@a57se @bklyndude 

Your criticizing an entire department.  Idzik isn't sitting on some throne making arbitrary draft choices.  The entire staff works together to determine the best pick at the time.  And I trust Rex and Marty (who aren't even the ones doing the real grunt work) on assessing these guys.

bklyndude
bklyndude

@a57se @bklyndude

And yet most people think the Jets have a top defense and have brought in some decent upgrades on the offensive side of things.   Idzik is trying to do what he can but ultimately the offense will be cured when we have a top QB.

I don't believe Idzik has passed on anybody who we should have jumped on at QB.

a57se
a57se

@Ceifus Hornswoggle @a57se 

You are correct Spent and I say that in my last response to bklyndude...

How much falls on Idzik? I am not sure yet but he is the one making the picks and signing the players.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@a57se @bklyndude

I think Vick, Geno and Boyd were all mistakes... 


And you also thought that David Garrard was a mistake, and that Teddy Bridgewater wasn't that great, and that you were not a fan of EJ Manuel either.


(notices pattern)

a57se
a57se

@tsjc68 @a57see

and I liked Logan Thomas as a developmental guy, hoped we would get Ja'Marcus Russell when he came out of College, loved Doug Williams when he QB'd the Redskins...


(notices pattern)

bklyndude
bklyndude

@a57se @tsjc68

You don't like any high pick by Idzik......

except Sheldon Richardson who nobody can dislike.



(notices pattern)

a57se
a57se

@bklyndude @a57se 

Like I said, his player evaluation skills are not that good from what i have seen...maybe some of that is systemic, I don't know for sure, but we have had difficulty in finding good players at certain positions over the years.

NYCPEinGermany
NYCPEinGermany

@a57se

"Like I said, his player evaluation skills are not that good from what i have seen..."


Well, they did draft the DROY last year