Daily Links: Penny Pinching?

  • Jets playing “Moneyball” [ESPN NY]
  • Mornhinweg gives “blessing” to potential Jackson signing [NFL Spin Zone]
  • Benoit: What are the Jets doing? [MMQB]
  • Reeves’ great pro day gets him contract with Jets [PFT]
  • Justin Gilbert to visit with Jets [NFL Spin Zone]
  • Douzable and Folk talk to Eric Allen [Jets Official Site]



304 comments
Floyd Toucanet
Floyd Toucanet

Negative Nelly and Self Loathing Larry give it a rest. The Jets have 12 picks in the "deepest draft in 30 years"  The Jets have good grades as far as drafting goes for the last ten years. Idzik picked the defensive rookie of the year and got 5 starters with 8 picks last year. 7-8 starters out of this draft is very possible, if not likely.  The value in the middle rounds is supposed to be insane this year. Idzik set the Jets up to have more draft picks in the best year to have it than the number of draft picks the Jets had in 2009, 2010, and 2011 combined. Don't believe me? Listen to the experts: 


"Speaking of scouts, I had another opportunity again to talk with one of the very best scouts in the business last week, when I talked to Chris Landry.

Landry first talked about the grades he has assigned to some prospects in the first round at this point:

"In terms of overall grades, you are right, I'm not completely done yet, but I can tell you that I'm on pace to have a higher number of first round grades that I've had in years. Maybe as high as 28 or 29, which is extraordinarily high."

Chris then talked about the rest of the talent and depth in the rest of the draft:

"It's really deep in the second and third rounds. Maybe even a little bit above that. So,  there is really good value. And what that means is that when you are picking in the fifth or sixth round, you will be getting in a lot of cases third-round value players. Because how you grade a player is how you see them and how they fit in a certain category. And that grade is corresponding to a round. But if you have more than 32 players with second-round grades, which you are definitely going to have this year, just do the numbers. If you have 42, you have 10 players who going to bleed into the third round with second-round grades. If you do the numbers going forward, I think there is going to be tremendous value here (in this draft)."

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/02/19/mike-mayock-deepest-draft-class-in-ten-years/


Take a deep breath and let the guy do his job. He already turned the cap from a liability into the team with the most flexibility in the NFL.

@denzilland
@denzilland

I think there is another observation I've picked up on over this past year with the New York Jets and that is how Woody Johnson has put together a stronger chemistry between GM & HC. I think the reports of John Idzik wanting he's own guy in there, may be true but I believe is a bit over blown. I've seen these two men interact in interviews and press conferences and don't sense that at all. I think the chemistry I've seen them exude is refreshing & I hope will be the reason for sustainable success in the futures for the team. I believe their strong relationship steams from the fact that both their fathers were coaches with the green & white, and both grew up as young kids around the Jets. I think that is special a and unique connection like no other in the NFL.

Let's see how the John & Rex era does with the products they put on the field the next few years. End with the Rex will be fired at the end of the season mantra. They already started nicely with a 8-8 record in their first season together, when most writers & analyst had the Jets pegged for the worst record in football last year. Now they are in a awesome position of having the lowest payroll in the league witch sets them up nicely to sign our young talent in the future. We have over 28.6M in cap space & 12 draft picks.

I think the Jets are in good hands, they have a GM now who has help build two Super Bowl champs in the 2004 Tampa Bay Bucs & the 2013 Seattle Seahawks. You have one of most unique defensive minds in football at HC who was part of another in the 2000 Baltimore Ravens. I say let's reset the clock on Rex's coaching tenure with the Jets and give John & Rex a three year window. Let the two kids who grew up around the Jets bring it home. The arrow is pointing up on the New York Jets franchise & I like the direction we are heading.

bonozoffa
bonozoffa

To say the Jets are playing "Moneyball" is just a dumb attempt by a old school media member to label something it doesn't understand or is not good for them from a journalistic perspective, which is typical of the Cimidiot. The fact is that just because there is a budget, it doesn't mean you need to spend it poorly. Because the truth is that FAs and their agents see the Jets and needing players and they're looking to extract longer term, bigger money from the Jets to play there. Idzik, to his credit, is offering neither, because doing so will create more problems in the long term than it will solve in the short term. And given the state of this franchise, the Jets need a long term perspective and focus. If there were a 23-24 y/o WR who was not a head case and was available, or a 25-26 y/o QB who was viable and could be built around, or a DB who understands he should not be paid like a WR or QB, I'd have no doubt Idzik would persue that player, and probably out bid to get that player. But the fact is that those kind of guys are not out there. At least as a free agent. The free agents out there are headaches, broken players, players a year or 2 from the end. So since that is the case, the right move is being made, and that is to hold onto your money in free agency, draft some players, resign your own, and then look to trade or target future free agents to make the team great.

Marvel
Marvel

O.T


but why did they push the draft back two weeks?  probably money reasons /ratings /buzz or something of that nature? 



If they really wanted ratings, why not do a round a day For one week?



__fense
__fense

So is the NFL Spin Zone thing worth reading? I have a feeling that if NFL.com can't be objective, a site with spin in the name wouldn't be.


You need to label the dumb articles you put up on the Daily links just to laugh at better, because I'm never sure.

Marvel
Marvel

As the draft moves on,would you guys say the talent pool drops off faster for offensive players or defensive players?


or is it just an inexact science..



I say that because it feels like a first round CB coupled with a 3rd round WR holds more talent value than a first round WR coupled with a 3rd round CB... 

 obvious answer..? draft is a crap shoot lol



Pat d
Pat d

I don't beleive it. If KC really wanted DJax they could have made it happen. Or only the Pats can make things happen.

Bent
Bent moderator

@Brendan  So I was both hilarious and right!

Bent
Bent moderator

@bonozoffa  


I agree with most of your comments here, but I can tell you I've heard the term "moneyball" actually used by front office sources to describe their approach to offseason planning more than once over the past few years.


Whether or not they are playing Moneyball, they think they are...or at least are trying to play some version of it at some level

ww85
ww85

How do you even know how much DJAX will get? He may not be more expensive than Decker. Don't know unless you at least keep in touch with his agent to see where his market is. DJAX is a diva and there is some baggage, but he may be maturing and he may not be. I can tell you this: Geno Smith threw to a smaller target but more crafty than DJAX in college named Tavon Austin and put up some mind blowing numbers. Geno to DJAX may be pretty impressive.

Also re Cimini. No problem busting on Cimini when he's wrong, but the money ball reference is apt. The jets are using a system to conserve cash and build for the long hall--we have no clue if they have some system like OBP in moneyball. A lot of his recent articles have been spot on.

a57se
a57se

@Marvel  

They pushed the draft back because Easter is later this year than usual and the Draft dates were already committed.

__fense
__fense

@Marvel  They apparently wanted 'one NFL thing a month" during the offseason. I can't tell you what's happening in April, but the short answer is yes, it's money/rating/buzz.

Bent
Bent moderator

@Marvel  Wasn't it something to do with a clash with a James Dolan event which isn't even happening any more?

Bent
Bent moderator

@__fense  


It's just another fansided or yardbarker type of blog.  Nothing much added to the original reports to be honest.

johnnyl65
johnnyl65

@Marvel  I'm of a like mind but also wouldn't mind if we went WR,OL or LB at 18. Whatever falls best.

Pat d
Pat d

It is true that the draft in an unexact science or crap shoot as you say. That doesn't mean FA is a sure thing. The fact is if a team doesn't draft well they won't make it to the Super Bowl regardless of what they do in FA. It is not the other way around.

__fense
__fense

@Marvel  Bassett had a post sometime last week that I think answered your question. It had the chart of the number of players at each position that are rated to go in each round. I'm pretty sure there were a lot of 2-3rd round WRs, and a lot of 4th round CBs, so offense might drop off first.

Bent
Bent moderator

@Marvel  Did you see BB's post and chart the other day?  That went into great detail about exactly what you seem to be asking.

Brian Serviss
Brian Serviss

@Pat d  yes because the cap space number is just opinion, it's not a factual number whatsoever 

bobbyj
bobbyj

For the record I have no idea what you and Brendan are talking about. I actually believe that the Jets are heavily involved in the DeShawn Jackson sweepstakes. The fact that you haven't heard anything is very telling. Idzik is an intelligent man he will wait for the market to establish itself, only fools rush in. Another sign is the Bills being mentioned as a potential team. This is a way to leverage the Jets into bidding.

robby7
robby7

@Bent The term "moneyball" refers to statistical analysis...In baseball they valued OBP and Slugging % to value the athletes as they believed they transferred to more wins - it just happened that these statistics did not lead to big bay days as did AVG, RBI and HRS...So what statistics are they valuing that other teams over look to where this could at all resemble money ball???

Pat d
Pat d

After bringing in Vick bringing in DJax would be the perfect recipe for a split locker room.

Marvel
Marvel

@a57se

 Just watched some more ODB jr highlights... his hands are ridiculous.


No body catches... I think his hands are what separates him from Lee for me.


johnnyl65
johnnyl65

@Bent @Marvel  Dolan cost us a domed stadium in Manhattan with his startup of a grass roots campaign to shoot it down. Damn Dolan.

Brendan
Brendan

@Bent Of course. James Dolan's finally stopped torturing my poor Knicks, so he's moved onto my favorite sporting league. 

Marvel
Marvel

@Disgruntled Jets Fan

 How do you feel about a 7 day draft?  maybe 6 days (do 6 and 7 together )..


personally I'm fine with the current format.


Pat d
Pat d

Whatever falls to a team when they pick is the key to a successful draft. Teams that draft for need end up reaching for players.

j3tsfan29
j3tsfan29

@patd tell that to the broncos. Tebow couldn't make the big dance but FA peyton manning got them there!

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent  Lot of misinformation flying about for sure.

robby7
robby7

Forgetting the term, I do like his approach, we are not one overpriced player away from a championship and that is our goal...we have a solid nucleus on defense but still could use 1-2 years of solid drafting, plus not overpaying for (MJD, Jackson, Byrd, etc. actually gives us more flexibility in the future) when we may be a player or two away (think Seahawks with Percy)

Brendan
Brendan

@Bent Yeah, that wouldn't make very much sense. 

Bent
Bent moderator

@Brendan


Yes, but when the team source used it, they were actually talking about the value of draft picks, rather than any on-field statistical analysis, which is why robby is correct to observe that "Moneyball" isn't as simple as many people think it is ... including that team source.

Bent
Bent moderator

@robby7 @Bent  


Robby - I agree with you here.  The term Moneyball is often over-simplified and misrepresented and when I heard a team source use it, they were guilty of this.  Their definition of "we are playing moneyball" was closer to the over-simplified version which everyone associates with the term than the actual complex sabermatic-based model that the original Moneyball actually was.

Brendan
Brendan

@robby7 Based on a conversation on another thread we had, elusiveness at the RB position is something they seem to be targeting with cheap options like Ivory and Goodson. Both of those guys are exceptional at making players miss/breaking tackles. 

Pete Whalen
Pete Whalen

Absolutely Dolan did, and would do so for any project that would detract from his businesses. But the west side deal has been going on long before Dolan arrived.

Brendan
Brendan

@Pete Whalen  But Dolan did put forth effort to block it, and since he doesn't put effort into anything besides his crappy band we can still hate him for that. Not that we need more ways. 

Pete Whalen
Pete Whalen

Dolan was not even close to the main culprit. Business owners/ property owners on the west side have blocked anything happening on that part of the city for 50 years.

johnnyl65
johnnyl65

@Pat d  All of the positions I named have players I find worthy to be a 18 pick.


Brendan
Brendan

@Marvel BPA*



*within reason. 


No more interior DL and no C, basically. 

Marvel
Marvel

@Pat d  

That sounds good... BPA is a good way to go,but u don't draft QB when you have Luck, you don't draft Center when you have Mangold etc.


There are exceptions to BPA.


Pat d
Pat d

This draft is deepest at WR and CB