Quote: But Timmy already was on bottom of the roster

“Obviously we made a couple mistakes – trading for Tim Tebow most notably.  But I would say beyond that, we [could have done a better job with the bottom of our roster], especially toward the end.”

– Former GM Mike Tannenbaum on his moves when running the Jets

53 comments
bob
bob

Sounds Like Tanny pitching a bid for a new management job.

Joan Israel
Joan Israel

The bottom line is that Mike Tannenbaum was a disaster as a GM, especially when you factor in that his owner [Johnson] basically gave him an open check book to sign guys. He was profligate with the owner's money, that's for sure.

And how did he ever get a reputation as an expert on the 'cap.?' He demonstrated precious little restraint and created huge cap problems signing guys, i.e., Sanchez, to enormous contracts without wiggle room to get out of those contract commitments. I, to be frank, would have been much more cautious in throwing money around like he did. He seemed not to look ahead very much in terms of the long-term cap situation.

I didn't understand why Tannenbaum operated in such a reckless manner until it dawned on me he -- probably with a Ryan chumping at the bit to sign guys right now -- thought that a championship was very, very close, and somehow figured the Jets were only a player or two away. So, he -- and Ryan -- went for broke, literally. That belief destroyed him

.

One more thing: All this 'chatter' about Tannenbaum being the villain in all these bad draft choices. I don't think it was his call -- choosing players. He's not a personnel guy, so he probably only OK'ed options presented by Ryan, scouts, the real football guys; Tannenbaum didn't make the first move, and say, 'that one's the guy I like,' As I said, the 'football' guys did that. That's a very difficult job skill, and takes years to develop.   He probably couldn't pick out on a field a mediocre, say, offensive tackle from a very good one -- that was never his function. So, even though I thought he was an absolute failure as a GM, I can't fault him for the bad Jet draft picks. Rex Ryan and his scout team are mostly at fault for that.


Jim Israel

foley
foley

Ummm..... what about the wide receivers and running backs at the top end of the roster?  Or quarterback?

Brendan
Brendan

Oh great. Livefyre is holding back a post with Steiny's tweet in it because why not? I shouldn't be allowed to post a TJB contributor's tweet about a Jets coach, that makes sense. 


Anyway, Steiny just tweeted that Dunbar is back. Good news. 

levi
levi

I wish we still had Tanny we would be selling the farm for Bridgewater!! :)

oddmanrush
oddmanrush

Do we still need analysis from Tannenbaum on his seven year run? Can he just please move on to the next chapter in his life already instead of constantly re-analyzing his time here in New York?

__fense
__fense

This is like the third time this quote was posted on this site.

harvlis
harvlis

Tanny made a big mistake, by forgetting about the O-line, at times.  The games are won up front.  Our D-line is serious.  Now, we need to upgrade the O-line.  Colon is coming back off surgery.  We need to pick up two solid guards, before the season starts.  Let Winters and Vlad back up and we have some inexpensive depth.  By giving D'Brick some help on his side of the line, we will be able to tell if he is still solid or if we have to upgrade in 2015.  I would try to steal a solid veteran away and add one of the top prospects in the draft.  We need some road graders! 

nesboogie
nesboogie

Almost, if not, every re-draft of the 2013 draft has Sheldon Richardson going number 1 overall, yet there's still doubt about him winning DROY lol. PFWA already gave it to Kiko, AP's next to go. Smh

nesboogie
nesboogie

Also hearing that #Jets DC Dennis Thurman and DL coach Karl Dunbar are re-signing, if they haven't already. Dunbar a key for young DL.

Per Rich Cimini


nesboogie
nesboogie

RichCimini
Also hearing that #Jets DC Dennis Thurman and DL coach Karl Dunbar are re-signing, if they haven't already. Dunbar a key for young DL.
1/18/14, 12:28 PM

jake100
jake100

I think Rex is looking for more than a puppet for DC, so he can concentrate more on the entire team.

jake100
jake100

The Jets tried to interview Haslett? I guess they are not happy with Thurman.

jaygo
jaygo

Interesting that he admits to the criticism, most recently from Westhoff, that his moves (like trading up in the draft and throwing money around recklessly) left the team with no depth.  That is a bigger admission of failure than Tebow.  We had nothing on special teams and were exposed to injuries.  Tanny rolled the dice and came up craps.  Put us back 2-3 seasons.  

jake100
jake100

T depleted the team over the years by giving away picks for overpriced and older FAS trying to hit the home run. Aside from a top player here and there, he forgot about mid level talent and the team wasted away and it caught up. In my book one of the biggest knocks on T was failure to develop Sanchez with providing talent around him and not supporting their huge investment. The writing was clear that with a solid supporting cast around him, Sanchez even as a rookie took the team to two AFC playoff games, but in 2011 the offense was decimated and many true leaders were let go. It is logical to assume that if Sanchez got that far as a rookie, that if the supporting cast was at least maintained and was not decimated, and that combined with Sanchez gaining experience, that a possible SB could have been in sight. Instead T gave out a ridiculous contract to Sanchez but did not back Sanchez with the resources to succeed and actually went in reverse with failing to address the offense, and all the head games, with Tebow and other nonsense. No legit organization would give out a huge contract to their qb, and then fail to build around  and support him. We all seen what a horrid offense does to qbs. Lets just hope the Jets learn from this and give Geno what he needs to succeed and learn from past mistakes....if you dont have an elite qb, you do the next best thing and that is build around what you have and give them weapons and a solid line that they need to succeed, HELLO!!!!!! Take a look at the last few SB teams and they all have a very solid offense with play makers, that simple. Most of the qbs having an offense like the jets have had the last few years would not go far. When Kerley is your best wr option and he would be the only starter from the jets offense on another team, that speaks volumes. Anyway, hopefully the Jets will have learned and give the offense and Geno some legit weapons as that is imperative for success and any chance at a run.

bradysucks
bradysucks

This guy Tannenbaum missed on every QB he ever drafted......but he scapegoats Tebow. How convenient.....


Kellen Clemens (round 2)

Mark Sanchez (round 1...5th overall pick who he gave away picks to get)

Eric Ainge (who cares)

Greg McElroy

I am sure I am forgetting somebody......



2nd round picks (Vlad and Hill)


Lets not forget Gholston......


How about if Tannenbaum MAN'S UP and  takes all of the blame himself.....instead of just scapegoating it on Tebow.......


Tebow was on the Pats this year and last I checked their GM still has a job

Pat d
Pat d

@Joan Israel

There is no way Rex a first time coach is making the personnel decisions. Also the huge Sanchez contract was dictated by where he was drafted. The extension was a mistake that made no sense. Moving up and drafting a QB didn't work out but that it wasn't really reckless. The lower pay that draft picks make now kind of eliminates a lot of that problem.

marcus81
marcus81

@Joan Israel in 09 and 2010 Jets where built to win now, all the eggs where put in one basket, when the Jets did not win it all there was the aftermath of trading drafting picks for veterans and going over the cap that had to be cleaned up, that's life, I personally would rather build the team through the draft through player development if you're lucky enough to have good coaches that will develop good players.

Bent
Bent moderator

@Joan Israel Jim - 


I'm afraid I don't agree with this take at all.  It's too close to the media portrayal and too far removed from reality.


Woody has given every GM the same "blank check book" to spend as he has always spent up to the cap throughout his time as an owner.  That didn't mean the GM had unlimited spending potential because they were still constrained by the salary cap itself and also, in Tannenbaum's case, the final eight plan in 2010.  Let's also remember that in his first year as GM Tannenbaum inherited Bradway's mess with the Jets in a far worse state than Tannenbaum left them in - $25m over the cap.


His reputation as a cap expert is ill-informed because people constantly gave him credit for stuff that everyone does.  However, he has come up with some revolutionary things in the past and every time the media said they had cap issues, they were just plain wrong.  They always maintained the flexibility to put a competitive team on the field, even in the year when he left.  How do we know this?  Because Idzik DID PUT a competitive team on the field even though they were paying a few guys they underused because of wanting to play the rookies, even though they had several key injuries and even after trading away their best player in a move which WORSENED their cap situation in the short term.  Idzik's approach to get the cap in order was to make a bunch of restructures which were planned by Tannenbaum and built into the contract deliberately, so Idzik just did exactly what Tannenbaum was going to do anyway.


Did Tannenbaum make the best use of the money he spent?  No he did not - but they were poor personnel decisions and there was absolutely a flexible cap structure in place.


I'm not even defending Tannenbaum here, he didn't do a particularly good job and even when things were going well he was getting praise that wasn't really warranted.  However, like the media, you're criticizing him for all the wrong things.


a57se
a57se

@jake100 

Yeah, that Redskins defense was SOOOO Impressive last season!

jake100
jake100

@jaygo 

Yup, right on NFL network, Tanny admitted he failed  Sanchez and he neglected the offense, I am just glad he is gone!!!!!!!! I just hope we learn from history or we are destined to repeat it. Build the OFFENSE!!!!!!!  Give your QB weapons, you cant just keep changing QBS with a horrid supporting cast and expect to succeed!

buckets
buckets

@jake100 
Dislikes same re-hashed JB comment being posted for the last three years....

levi
levi

@bradysucks I know right. How did he ever last as long as he did? He never drafted any good players at all.

Joan Israel
Joan Israel

@Bent@Joan Israel 

Bent, we agree to disagree. Your counterarguments are well taken. BUT, there's is no way I'll agree that Tannenbaum did a good job with the 'cap.' You don't think signing Sanchez to that ridiculous contract when he didn't have to was a good idea, and didn't harm the cap situation? It had to worsen it. Tannenbaum made other outrageous, irrational moves, i.e., signing Holmes to a $45 million contract, even though Pittsburgh basically threw him out, and he could have been had for much less. Crazy, or stupid: take your pick.

I will agree with you about Bradway leaving Tannenbaum a worse mess than even what Tannenbaum left Idzik. 

I'll never ever be dislodged of my belief that Tannenbaum did a terrible job -- never. But, one mitigating factor is he really wasn't ever equipped to do the job of GM. I think you have to, these days, be in control of everything, especially personnel decisions. Tannenbaum was a numbers guy, and I think his deficiencies as a talent evaluator made him defer to an emotional Rex Ryan on talent issues. Idzik, I pray, can be an equal partner in evaluation. 


Barry Switzer, of all people, once said of Jerry Jones' skill as a talent evaluator: 'The problem with Jerry is he can't pick out the bad ones.' What he meant was, say, when 20 pro prospects are running around on a field, if you're not a personnel person, you can't pick who's really good and who may just be good. They would all look like stars. Tannenbaum, I just know, didn't have that skill set.


Jim I

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @jake100 I'd imagine this was to see if he was leaving to tap up as a position coach.  He's not though, so that's that.

frustjetfn
frustjetfn

@jake100"you can't keep changing QB'S" Was that his problem? Tanny & Rex stayed with Sanchez for 4 YEARS based on the HOPE that he would develop despite evidence to the contrary. And now you want to do the same thing with Geno?


The lesson is to STOP running on hope, projection and excuses and start running on fact. Geno may develop in the future, but he is NOT an average NFL QB now. So you can surround him with more weapons, try to minimize his mistakes that will cost you games and hope to hide your lack of a fully capable QB, but you are doing the exact same thing that you did with Sanchez. You are fooling yourself because you awarded a position to someone who didn't have to compete for it and now you are stubbornly committing years to your hope.


Good teams don't award starting spots & stay with someone who was their only option at the time, years after they can import other options. Instead, after surviving a temporary, no choice fix they bring in other players the next year to improve the team. Then let the best player play and continue to try to develop the rest. You may not realize it, but you are committed to criticizing the Sanchez mistake while saying that they should repeat it.

jaygo
jaygo

@jake100 Jury is still necessarily out on Idzik but I like what I see.  He runs a tighter ship and appears to take a longer view than "win now" at all costs.  Impressed but the player moves, the media control, the absence of circus, the handling of Rex and the new found stability.  I got a sense he will surprise us this off-season, not good not bad just surprise.  No one was expecting Sheldon Richardson to the Jets first round and he may just be the best pick of the entire draft last year.  I sense another one like that.  Maybe like a stud OL guy with the 1st or 2nd picks and the guy turns out to be a star for 10 years.  

levi
levi

@buckets He's been holding that "paste" in his pocket a long time waiting for a Tannenbaum article.

bradysucks
bradysucks

Tanny was not a good GM - He left the Jets in shambles

a57se
a57se

@jake100 

Talent around a QB isn't going to help him read defenses better or increase his field vision or improve his footwork or increase his accuracy.

These are all things you can judge on any QB regardless of the situation and if a QB stinks in these areas............then he just stinks. no amount of talent will help that.

frustjetfn
frustjetfn

@jake100@frustjetfnMost fans point to the demise of talent around Sanchez after 2 years, but miss the point that Sanchez was part of the demise of talent on O. If you recall, the Jets tried to get Mark to understand game situations, read defenses, improve his techniques and QB skill set and failed. Remember the infamous color code system? Nothing helped b/c Mark could not develop so WHEN the tools around him got weaker his faults were obvious. 

It proves you can't hide your QB, the most important position on the team, forever. One slip-up by the supporting cast is when QB talent is revealed. If the QB steps up and adjusts he has good instincts and may develop into a keeper, but if he repeatedly fails you should look elsewhere. Mechanics can be taught, instincts can't.

jake100
jake100

@frustjetfn @jake100 


I think most Jet fans understand that the weak offense is what is holding the team back and needs the highest priority of attention. I could not count all the posts that reflect that, and that is exactly the meat of what my posts are about, that a qb can not take the team to next level without a solid and balanced offense. Lets just hope the Jets go full tilt in this deficient area and we will be fine. 

jake100
jake100

@frustjetfn @jake100 


The first two years Sanchez did well for a rookie with a solid team around him, so they had to stick with him then, then they decimated the offense in 2011, and still did nothing for it in 2012. 2013 also showed the scars of very weak offense. It was not sticking with Sanchez too long that was the problem, as the first two years he was exempt as a rookie and young QB, the problem was the deteriorating offense after that. Whether it was Sanchez, McElroy, Geno, Simms or whoever else, they need a competent offense with weapons to succeed. Our offense has had no playmakers and ranked in the low 20s the last 3 years. I dont care what qb you put in, they need a solid offense to succeed unless you hit on a brady and even he in the beginning of the year when he lost a couple of his main weapons sunk in the QB stats! Just look at the two teams that make it to the SB and you will see a very solid supporting cast around the qb with electric playmakers. Most QBS cant do it by themselves as that shows.

buckets
buckets

@frustjetfn
Good teams don't award starting spots & stay with someone who was their only option at the time, years after they can import other options.


Andy Dalton....


jake100
jake100

@frustjetfn @jake100 


I agree, but to give your qb a chance the talent has to be there around him. What I meant by the changing qb remark is , unless you have an elite qb, the majority wont succeed behind a horrid supporting cast as we have seen.

bradysucks
bradysucks

Buttfumble

You should re-watch the beatings the Fins and Pats gave us at home in 2012 and Rex's press conferences afterwards ......2012 Jets were the worst Jets team ever no matter what their record was.....and Tebow barely even played in 2012.....but lets blame the guy who was benched all year

bradysucks
bradysucks

The 2012 Jets were the most embarrassing team EVER and I've never been as embarrassed as a Jets fan. Thank God Woody Johnson agreed and fired Tannenbaum

buckets
buckets

@bradysucks How many GMs lave their jobs with the team in great shape?  And I disagree with this anyway.  For a team that was recently left in shambles, the Jets are certainly in position to make great improvment next season.

bradysucks
bradysucks

Drafting Sanchez was his worst move.... Followed by Vlad and Hill

I don't think Tebow is a good QB but the point is Tannenbaum never found a good QB and Tebow was not the only QB he missed on

buckets
buckets

@bradysucks How was aquiring Tim Tebow not his worst move as GM?  GMs miss on draft picks all of the time.  We already knew that Tebow was both a terrible quarterback and distraction and yet aquired him anyway with little plan on how to use him.

bradysucks
bradysucks

I am just not dumb enough to scapegoat Tannenbaum's failure to draft a good QB in 10 years on just Tebow...