Daily Links: 51 Days Until Football

  • Rotoworld ranks Jets’ pre-camp roster No. 26 in NFL [NJ]
  • Colon wants to try broadcasting when his NFL career ends [Star-Ledger]
  • Jets Roster Predictions: Pre-Training Camp [Pro Football Spot]
  • Donovan McNabb: Playoffs for the Jets [The New York Jets]
  • Ex-Jet writes op-ed about paying student-athletes [Vice Sports]
  • Karl Dunbar: The Man Behind the Jets’ Defensive Line [One Jet at a Time]
  • ‘Snacks’ no longer a secret for Jets, still a weapon [NY Post]



80 comments
Kirk Michael
Kirk Michael

When you look at Rex and Dunbar are both the best at what they do and Marty is up there in this league. We have the stable of backs, a top 3 front 7 in the league, i believe what will be the best d line in the game, an O line that can be in the top 10-12, WRs are getting more consistent,talented, and more explosive, and Qb is our biggest issue with a top 5 qb I think our odds to win the super bowl would be up there and we would be top a 1 to 3 team. So if G just an avg season with alot less turnovers gives us a chance. I see a playoff team and we have the type of team to make a run at it when we get there with the backs n the line + the defense I believe will be one teams don't want to play this season.

Kirk Michael
Kirk Michael

Wilson n Hill are in same position, Coples really didnt just miss two games he basicaly missed 5 or 6 because the brought him back easy n the position change. From day one I felt he belonged at d end in a 4-3 or olb at 3-4. Now hes there he lost the weight, I believe he wants it and he will end up showing us all this yr. He does show flashes of great brilliants and great athleticism being in the backfield with a back on the ground so fast it seemed like he started the play off sides. I think we can get the best out of these 4 + bunch of guys by committee. The SONS OF ANARCHY, Q, N PACE N COMPANY ( Mccintyre, Cunningham, Barnes, etc,)

a57se
a57se

Overall, the Roster spot piece was actually pretty good despite our resident experts' (68) dismissal of it.

He only has 8 of our 12 draft picks making the team which would be a surprise given last years result of carrying all the picks on the 53 man roster even though they weren't gonna play.

Looking at his final roster it is hard to come up with 4 guys to cut and replace with the rookies the author thinks will be cut.

I could see Reilly or Enemkpali replacing McIntyre at ILB if they show enough in camp to be useful...

I don't see anyone I would want to cut to keep Dixon on the roster at CB at this time...Dowling doesn't even make the roster and he's been impressive so far.

Maybe Hill stinks up the joint and gets cut but I doubt that...so that leaves nelson out in favor of Enunwa? I Like Enunwa better than Evans personally.

The obvious (?) mistake is Freeman being left out for Schlauderaff but Caleb has been the Jets back-up Center the last few years so I would think Freeman would have to show a lot to stick since he still has PS options...


koala
koala

@a57se there is no way Nelson gets cut I dont think

elmoron
elmoron

@a57se Agree with all of this 57, although I'm a little partial to Evans over-the-middle while believing Enunwa's value is more in the Red Zone at this point.  Unless Barnes gets hurt again, Enemkpali may be further away than Reilly who's more familiar with the OLB position...Edd's makes it (if we carry 9) while Cunningham could be on a bubble...based on his apparently good OTA,  Dowling beats out either Walls or Langster, both of whom I like...Freeman over Schlauderaff, if only because the two games that Mangold missed were nightmares for me, and certainly for Sanchez, especially the Ravens game which appeared to send Mark into an irrecoverable tailspin...Ijalana will likely stick (still wish we could have gotten Duvernay-Tardiff in the 6th), Oday as the swing G/T, and then pick up a decent training camp cut (if only because I haven't heard much about Qvale, a decent UDFA pickup since we wouldn't/couldn't snag Tiny Richardson)...Hyder & Devitto to PS. 

BDarc23
BDarc23


@UncleJoesJetFarm The 1st couple of weeks of the season are always filled with upsets. Bad teams seem to be able to win early.  I'd be concerned somewhat no matter who the Jets were playing.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@UncleJoesJetFarm

I'm not going to laugh at your specific concerns about the Raiders, because I also think the Raiders could surprise and be better this year (I like the changes McKenzie is making).


That being said, yes, I will laugh at your continued ability to find new things to be terrified about daily.

Ceifus Hornswoggle
Ceifus Hornswoggle

@UncleJoesJetFarm 

The guy is 6'6", 260 pounds.  Why can't he block?  Gronk is the same size and he's a heck of a blocker.  Sounds like he's afraid of a little dirty work.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@UncleJoesJetFarm

Wild card: None of the tight ends are sturdy blockers, which makes you wonder if they will address the need at some point during training camp. Ben Hartsock, who played with the Jets in 2009 and 2010, is a free agent. 


No, Rich, we're not going to go sign Ben Freaking Hartsock.  And I am not "wondering if we will address" a need that is not actually a need.

hitchhiker
hitchhiker

Has MM ever utilized a "blocking" TE? My understanding is TEs that can't catch have little value in a WCO.

jsadolph
jsadolph

@UncleJoesJetFarm @tsjc68 

I also think the Radiers will be improved this year.  But I think it will be a KC Chiefs bump like last year.  The Chiefs were horrible in 2012 and made a lot of one yr bandaide type moves and they had a good year last year(with the help of a light schedule).  But this year they have lost their whole O-Line and will be bottom dwellers again.

The Raiders are similar.  They have brought in the whole "Expendables" cast making their last Hurrah.  They could be good this year, but it will not be sustainable.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@hitchhiker

I can't think of one.  In Philly, his guys were LJ Smith and Brent Celek.  In Detroit, David Sloan.  In Frisco, Greg Clark and Irv Smith.


I mean, Marty's not going to say "I don't want tight ends who can block", but yes, he's always going to prioritize pass-catching TEs, and that's probably smart, all things considered.


If you can't have someone who can do both and must choose, a pass-catching TE helps the overall offense way more than a run-blocking one does.  And, importantly, a pass-catching TE helps the running game more than a run-blocking TE helps the passing game (simply by presenting a receiving threat that the defense must account for, and thus pulling a defender out of a run-fit assignment to account for a TE running a route).

tsjc68
tsjc68

@jsadolph @UncleJoesJetFarm @tsjc68

At the risk of sounding like Hank, I think the unsustainable gains the Chiefs made will be unsustainable and I think this is the year the Raiders finally escape the cellar.

harold
harold

@tsjc68

Also Cumberland is not terrible.  He is average which is all we need.

a57se
a57se

@BDarc23 @a57se 

There was a stretch where every year we were going out there to play...seems like we always struggled.

jsadolph
jsadolph

@tsjc68 @jsadolph @UncleJoesJetFarm 

The raiders could come out a little better.  But they are betting on a bunch of youngsters to step up because their old guys that they brought in only have about a year or 2 left in them.

jsadolph
jsadolph

@a57se @BDarc23 

I seem to remember that from a few yeeards back when we had the AFC West and the NFC west when the both sucked and we went out there and had our a$$ handed to us.  It was embarassing.  And the travel, IMO, had a lot to do with it.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@UncleJoesJetFarm @tsjc68 @Ceifus Hornswoggle

I get what you're saying.  I'm just saying, as long as the TE prospect in question is not an undersized joker like an Aaron Hernandez or a Jordan Reed (and Amaro is obviously not undersized), NFL teams have a history of taking big pass-catching TEs from college programs that rarely asked them to block and coaching them up into capable (if unspectacular) blockers.


Take a look at this PFF article examining the best pass-blocking TEs in the league (dated from 2012):


https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/07/15/three-years-of-pass-blocking-efficiency-tight-ends/


You'll see guys similar to Amaro's profile, names like Marcedes Lewis, Brent Celek, Jason Witten, Tony Gonzalez, etc.  I'll grant you that Amaro was given a blocking assignment less frequently than those guys as collegians, but those guys were also not frequent or particularly skilled blockers either.  Jason Witten at Tennessee wore #1 and went out on pass-patterns constantly.  Marcedes Lewis was the collegiate version of modern-day Jimmy Graham.  They split him wide like a big WR and threw jump-balls.


Antonio Gates.  Vernon Davis.  Graham himself.


None of them were good or practiced blockers as collegians.  All of them, since they have the requisite size to handle blocking, became at least competent and useful blockers as pros.


-------------


And Celek's name on that list is most intruiging, since Celek was Marty's TE that he grew from the ground up.  Celek was not a skilled blocker at Cincy, he was basically a slot WR in a TEs body (sounds familiar).  He ran tons of pass patterns there.  In Philly, as the PFF article notes, he actually stayed in to handle pass-protect a lot (while simultaneously being a featured receiving target in Marty's offense).


Celek learned how to become useful both as a WR and as a blocker.  He might be your Amaro parallel.

a57se
a57se

@jsadolph 

Yes, though the infamous Hot Dog games was in Oakland and we won that handily!

jsadolph
jsadolph

@a57se @jsadolph 

I though t the same thing as I was writing it.  Only the jets have more second, third and forth year guys to step up.  The Raiders are relying on 10-14 yr vets to hold the fort until the Rooks take over, with little inbetween.

I will take our situation any day.

a57se
a57se

@Bent 

How many blocks have you seen him make?

2?

a57se
a57se

@jsadolph @a57se 

That is true but the Jets are still counting on guys to step up...that is the big ?

tsjc68
tsjc68

@UncleJoesJetFarm @tsjc68 @Ceifus Hornswoggle


If forced at gunpoint to bet your bank account on Jace Amaro being good at blocking or bad at blocking, which would you choose?


Keep in mind the following:

A.) Jace Amaro has rarely been asked to do much blocking, since he was primarily a receiving target running pass patterns

B.) While we don't know how well he'll block as a pro, since he didn't do much blocking as a collegian, Jace Amaro is also 6'6" 260 with quick feet


Once we start asking untested Jace Amaro to start being tested on this, what does your gut tell you that he'll become?  Does it tell you he'll probably be a bad blocker or a good one? 

BDarc23
BDarc23

@a57se @Bent Wow. you are getting an early start with the instigating comments.  

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent How many failed blocks have you seen him make?


0?

Bent
Bent moderator

@UncleJoesJetFarm @Bent @tsjc68 @Ceifus Hornswoggle


I've seen plenty of highlights of him making blocks in the open field and on special teams (arguably a more difficult technique than in-line blocking).  I haven't seen him missing blocks in those situations.

jsadolph
jsadolph

@a57se @jsadolph 

How many teams are not counting on guys to step up?  Maybe the Broncos and Pats.  But they have QB's about to retire and they will be in the same boat. 

a57se
a57se

@tsjc68 

I'd bet against it as most good blocking TE's are already capable at his point in time...

tsjc68
tsjc68

@BDarc23 @a57se @Bent

Wow. you are getting an early start with the instigating comments.  


He's like Bargnani, setting up at the top of the key with 21 seconds left on the shot clock, just waiting for someone to pass him the ball for the spotup jumper he'll miss.


(ducks)

a57se
a57se

@BDarc23 @a57se @Bent 

I don't like sugarcoating, it leaves an awful taste in my mouth so early in the morning and saying that Amaro is a good blocker is ridiculous.

a57se
a57se

@Bent 

Watch more tape...he misses his fair share when the DB actually has some quickness.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@Bent @UncleJoesJetFarm @tsjc68 @Ceifus Hornswoggle


I've seen plenty of highlights of him making blocks in the open field... I haven't seen him missing blocks in those situations.


And that's critical, because, as I've said, open-field and down-field blocking is probably the blocking assignment he'll get as opposed to standard, Hartsockian inline blocking.


In a Marty WCO, a TE running what appears to be a pass pattern and then cracking back on a defender in the open field on a run or a screen pass is frequently the way that the TE contributes to the running game.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@a57se @tsjc68

Fine.


Now let me change your options from "Good" vs. "Bad" into "Effective" vs. "Ineffective".


At gunpoint, what is your new choice?  What are you going to bet all your money on?


Keep in mind what Bent already said:  That he was rarely asked to block at TTU, but that when he was asked to block at TTU he rarely missed a block.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@a57se @BDarc23 @Bent

Saying that Amaro is a good blocker is ridiculous.


But Bent didn't say that, he said "I've been impressed with what blocking I've seen from him."


I'm not going to say that Steve McQueen is a good director, because I've only seen one of his movies.  But, I've been impressed by what moviemaking I've seen from Steve McQueen, and therefore he MIGHT be a good director, and thus attempts to portray him as a BAD director seem likely off the mark.

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent All I said was "I've been impressed with what blocking I've seen from him."  I think that's a reasonable stance.

a57se
a57se

@tsjc68 @a57se 

Ineffective...again, it is something you need to be doing for some time to get good at (if you have the requisite skill set.

We don't know if he has the requisite skill set or the determination to learn this.

a57se
a57se

@Bent @a57se 

Yeah but your voice carries weight on this blog and making statements like that is irresponsible.

The majority of Amaro's blocks were (the few he actually attempted) thrown against out matched CB's and safeties in a weak defensive conference.

He should have looked good blocking those guys...

He will have a much larger task blocking NFL DB's and LB's...

a57se
a57se

@Bent @a57se 

How much tape have you watched on Amaro?

You have said many times that you don't study college tape anymore.

a57se
a57se

@UncleJoesJetFarm 

and the guy was a ONE YEAR WONDER. He caught 32 balls his first two years in college.


tsjc68
tsjc68

@BDarc23 @tsjc68 @a57se @Bent

That's a stellar article find, BDarc.  Nice.


Echoes what Bent was saying:  Amaro's not "bad', just untested (or at least undertested).  He was rarely asked to block, and when he was asked to block he wasn't given particularly challenging blocking assingments, but on those rare assignments he handled them with aplomb and did what he was supposed to do.


And that you can't say he's a good blocker yet but you can say that he's blocked well in limited opportunities and shows all the necessary skills to become not just a passable or acceptable blocker but a good one.

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent Why?  Cumberland, Sudfeld and Keller never looked good blocking those guys.  I'm looking for raw talent on which he can build not elite NFL level talent from day one.

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent I have.  And I'm not claiming to be any kind of expert on the subject nor have I ever.


I made a comment saying that I was impressed with what blocking I have seen of him.  Wasn't expecting the Spanish Inquisition.


I watched several of the cut-ups from that site where they show every relevant snap, not just highlights.

harold
harold

@a57se @UncleJoesJetFarm

Actually not.  He had a good Soph year but got hurt.  So he has solid tape from 2012.  May have even been All Big 12 that season as well even with injury.

a57se
a57se

@Bent @a57se 

I guess i expect you to give measured and well researched answers, that must not be fair of me...

a57se
a57se

@harold 

He caught 32 balls his first two seasons...that is a FACT!

7 his freshman year and 25 his sophmore season.

MoSacks MoSnacks
MoSacks MoSnacks

You really need to grow up at this point. The only reason you're instigating this is because Bent doesn't share your opinion. All Bent did was state an opinion "based on what he has seen." It wasn't an opinion attacking someone else's opinion. And your response? To attack his opinion by making a broad, general, unverified statement of opinion and then to make further statements effectively attacking his intelligence and professionalism. He's entitled to his opinion, and he didn't slant Amaro into being a godlike blocker. You're entitled to your opinion, but you aren't entitled to personally attack someone else for having an opinion opposite of yours without just cause.

harold
harold

@a57se

The number of balls in a different offense is not a legit comparison.  He was highly effective 25 catches for 409 yds and 4 TD's.  16.4 yards per catch.  Pretty good in basically little more than half a season. 

Go look at many college TE's.  Even his soph stats are on par with many of them

a57se
a57se

@harold 

Still nothing compared to his Jr. season with over 100 catches...

If you want to project, you are better using his sophmore stats but you also have to look at who he played against.

The simple spread offense he played in at tech is not a breeding ground for successful NFL rookies.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@a57se @tsjc68

I love when you throw up the "You're a Happy Mealer" white flag of argumentative surrender.

harold
harold

@a57se

I am not debating anything on his NFL potential.  Just pointing out using catches in a different offense, where his stats were on pace with many of the top TE's in the country his soph year is not really a fair comparison.

Lastly, I think the stats also show based on that level of production he was not a one year wonder.

a57se
a57se

@tsjc68 @a57se 

OK, based on your player analysis and Draft Chart you posted back in April, your analytical skills are lacking in that you miss a lot of obvious flaws in players...

So I am not surprised you can't tell that Amaro is not a good blocker.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@a57se @tsjc68

I can't tell if Amaro is not a good blocker because we don't know yet if he can block NFL linebackers instead of just cracking back against NFL safeties and CBs (which we know he can do, as it's evident in his tape).


I also don't know if Amaro will ever be asked to block against NFL LBs (or just chip against them, which seems more likely, given how Marty uses TEs, as evidenced by how he used Brent Celek, who is practically Amaro's doppelganger).


I also don't know that any of this is a real concern, as Jace Amaro is a 6'6" 260 mountain of a man, and NFL teams routinely take TEs his size who show the physicality that he shows and coach them up into capable blockers .


I totally get watching Amaro's gametape and saying "Gun to my head, I don't think this guy will ever be a good blocker because his development curve is too far behind other really good blocking TEs.)


I can't fathom how you'd say "Gun to my head, this guy will be an ineffective blocker in the pros" when the gametape shows him winning favorable size matchups in blocking assignments and he possesses a favorable size advantage in most of the blocking assingments that he's likely to receive as a pro.


Jace Amaro is 6'6" 260 and successfully blocked 6'1" 200 safeties and 6'3" 240 linebackers at TTU.  (It didn't happen often, but it did happen.)


Will he thus be able to stonewall an onrushing Mario Williams? No.  Will he ever be asked to do this?  Highly unlikely.


It's like criticizing Coples for not being able to drop into coverage.  He's not actually going to do that, so who cares?