Jets receiving corps rising ‘from the ashes’

The Jets receiving corps isn’t the best in the game, but they’ve risen from the ashes to something of respectable quality, Mike Tanier wrote (Sports on Earth, June 23).

Tanier tagged the Jets as a team that, “no longer consists of players who seem to have been selected to make the offense worse.”

Eric Decker, Jeremy Kerley, David Nelson, Stephen Hill and others will likely make up the receivers in 2014. He pointed out Jalen Saunders, Shaquelle Evans and Jace Amaro as players that could make an impact this season catching the ball.




227 comments
j_spikett
j_spikett

idzik has done a great job of stockpiling receivers. the defense was solid and now this team pardon the pun is ready to take off.

buckets
buckets

Ok. Well its settled. The Knicks wide receivers are going to be dope this year.

a57se
a57se

Nice start to the Jackson era;

Knicks get Dalembert, Calderon, Larkin, Ellington plus the 34th and 51st picks in the draft! All that for Chandler and Felton!

Brendan
Brendan

@jake100 I'm going to guess that the opinion of the guy who is battling for the 3rd QB spot isn't all that relevant. 

Bent
Bent moderator

@bob That's an unfortunate turn of phrase to have used when talking about a young QB trying to cut down on his turnovers.  I wish he'd said "select" or "choose" instead of "pick".

Ron Alexander
Ron Alexander

@j_spikett Wow, a great job? Are you kidding? We have a very good #2 receiver in Decker, a 6-4 inch pigeon head who cant catch a cold or stay healthy and has no idea how to get open or to fight for the ball in the air, three rookie's who were drafted much higher than anyone had them slotted, a good slot receiver who has had more than his share of injuries and a bunch of nobodies who have proven nothing other than they are marginal back ups at best. Hey, yes its possible some of these guys may turn out to be good players but there is zero star power at this position so how you figure this a great job is beyond me bro?

braziljets
braziljets

@Bent The 1st G group will prob face Algeria, France and Brazil. The 2nd will have prob  Belgium, Argentina and Netherlands.

So I will root for US to win and send German to the other side! LOL But I still think it's gonna be a good game to watch.

a57se
a57se

@Bent 

Meh, this isn't the same situation at all and playing for a draw is a time honored tradition in soccer.

a57se
a57se

That also gives them a little ammo to try and possibly trade up in the draft if there is someone they really like.

bob
bob

@Bent 

Also in addition to that the 2nd year thing got me thinking about his kid.

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent I beg to differ.  If the game stays tied and teams decide not to try and score in the second half, both qualify, with the added bonus that Portugal is out.


Whether this previous incident would be enough to dissuade the Germans from this approach is another matter, but most of all I just thought I'd share an interesting story with some historical relevance.

Brendan
Brendan

@a57se There's no chance they try to draw. The US will be happy with one because Germany is better, but that's not the same as trying for a draw. 

Brendan
Brendan

@a57se It's rare that teams package picks to move up, but they could package the 34th with a player and try to get in. 


Ellington is an intriguing off-the-bench shooter, but he literally can do nothing else. 

braziljets
braziljets

@Eddy Lopez @braziljets Agree. And that's gonna be tough, I bet. As Brazilina, anything that can complicate Argentina would be very appreciate! LOL

Brendan
Brendan

@Bent The response to Algeria's complaint is just....wow. Imagine someone said that today? 

a57se
a57se

@Brendan @a57se 

My point is simply that the US squad is probably outmanned v the Germans so playing for a draw is a legit strategy for them.

Is it worth it for Germany to try and force the issue when a loss would put them min Jeopardy???

Heck NO!

a57se
a57se

@Brendan @a57se 

Yup but the Knicks are in a much better position now then they were before the trade...there has been talk of them looking at buying a pick, now they have some bait.

Brendan
Brendan

@a57se Yeah, they'll probably play the same 4-2-3-1 they used against Portugal and flood the midfield and try to counter-punch, so that's fair. 


I guess my comment was more about Germany not siting back, I expect them to push the pace and bring it to the US, not the opposite. 


It will be a fun game, but I will be a nervous wreck. 

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Brendan I think both teams will be very careful to try and keep the game close.

Brendan
Brendan

@a57se Well, you can literally just buy a pick without giving up a player, but that might be tough. I wonder if they're looking to trade Larkin and cash to get into the middle of the first. 

juunit
juunit

@Brendan @a57se 

F*** that. I was all excited when Larkin almost fell to 18 or whatever it was. Now that we have him, I'm not trying to give him right back up. 

Brendan
Brendan

@Bent Hey, it was almost good enough to beat Portugal! And with the new experience under his belt, Dempsey probably won't let up a stoppage time goal this game!

Brendan
Brendan

@juunit I'm fine with keeping him, it's been a while since the team had a legit PG prospect, but I wouldn't be surprised to see him packaged to move up. 

juunit
juunit

@Brendan @juunit 

I wouldn't necessarily assume he's a true starting PG. He's a good passer, but he's got some work to do if he wants to flirt with 10 assists per game. 

Only way I see him getting traded is if it's for a star player, like Love. Far as I know the Knicks scouting department has liked Larkin for a while. 

Brendan
Brendan

@juunit Well, if your measuring stick is 10 assists, it's going to be tough to win your approval (only 1 player had double-digit assists last year, 5 others were 8.5+). He averaged 1.5 assists in 10 minutes last year, I think with normal growth and more PT a guy who gets 7-8 assists a game while also creating his own shots and not shying away from open looks. Since the triangle relies less on a PG to create chances for his teammates, Larkin might be a great fit for the guard spot at the top of the key. I think the Knicks got a great deal here, and I understand why the Mavs brought Chandler back as their window is closing. I'd be curious to hear what the Mavs fans are saying about this. 

a57se
a57se

@Brendan @juunit 

Is it a foregone conclusion that the knicks are being built to run the Triangle offense?

bklyndude
bklyndude

@Brendan @juunit

I'm sure the Mav's remember Chandler from their championship year and don't realize his game is in a downward spiral.    

He is no longer the guy who was the defensive player of the year,  and he has less offensive ability now then he had with them,  which is hard to believe.

juunit
juunit

@Brendan @juunit 

Yeah, he's perfect for the triangle. Right now he's kind of in that in between a 1 and a 2 place. But he can score from anywhere and has a pretty jump shot. My question is just if he can consistently be the facilitator on offense. He was more a scorer in college which created some open lanes for passing instead of vice versa, which is what you ideally want in a PG.

I imagine I'd feel fleeced if I were a Mavs fan. Felton is awful, so they gave up 4 players and 2 picks for Chandler, a guy who is mostly useless on offense and usually plays 75% of the games. 

Brendan
Brendan

@a57se No, but I think it became much more likely with Fisher being the hire. 


It'll be varied and altered to the team depending on how the final roster looks. They used to run it in LA with Kobe playing the center role sometimes, for example. It won't be rigid, but I think the base offense will be a the triangle. 

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Brendan @juunit No...and even if they were I think you need a more varied approach these days anyway.

juunit
juunit

@bklyndude @Brendan @juunit 

You think? He's kind of added a jumper. But he's still mostly a lob and occasional layup guy. I wouldn't say his offense has regressed. More so just remained impotent. 

Bent
Bent moderator

@juunit @Brendan Do you really need that facilitator on offense if you're running the triangle?


Paxson and BJ just used to dribble it up, give it to MJ and then spot up in the corner.  Anyone can do that.

Bent
Bent moderator

@Brendan @a57se Yeah, Kobe ... not someone you'd necessarily say was a better passer than Melo.

bklyndude
bklyndude

@juunit @bklyndude @Brendan

He's become useless in any offensive game plan and his defense is no longer of the elite kind that made him tolerable on the offensive end.   Carmelo must have cringed at how limited Tyson was out there.

Phil Jackson was lucky to get a decent deal for him and dump Felton at the same time.   I thought Oklahoma was going to make a push for Chandler.

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @juunit @Brendan I'm surprised how well the Knicks did in this trade.  I wonder if the Mavs also get a trade exception or something like this.

juunit
juunit

@Bent @juunit @Brendan 

True. But, it remains to be seen if Fisher will run the triangle. And, even if he does, it remains to be seen how long this current regime will last. Everyone has faith because it's Phil Jackson, but he is new to being team president. I wouldn't rule out the possibility that it doesn't work out. I mean, he's already gotten fined for tampering hasn't he? And that's after he missed out on his first choice for coach. 

Bent
Bent moderator

@juunit @Bent @Brendan Well, Fisher played for Jackson in Los Angeles when he was that "facilitator" in the triangle with Kobe playing the MJ role.  Naturally he never sniffed five assists per game, let alone 10.


Of course, banking on Melo to be your MJ might be a flawed plan, but I bet we see some variation on this theme.

Brendan
Brendan

@juunit I think Phil can do no wrong in Dolan's eyes. He's a huge star fcker. He's also getting paid a TON and while Dolan is rich, I dunno if he'll fire Phil if he has a bunch of years left on his deal. 

Brendan
Brendan

@Bent INK AIN'T EVEN DRY ON THE PAGE!


What could they package those two to get? A pick? Who is trading picks for Dalembert? 

a57se
a57se

@Bent @brendan @a57se 

I wonder if they are going after draft picks in an effort to create as much cap space as possible?

juunit
juunit

@Bent @juunit @Brendan 

Let's see if Melo comes back first. I mean, if we swap Melo for Lebron, then sure, Lebron could handle the point forward. And if we get neither of them, then we f***ed. 

juunit
juunit

@Brendan @juunit 

That's probably true. But Larkin is young. So even if Phil does fail and spends 3-4 years here, Larkin would still potentially be the PG for another 7-8 years after that. 

Bent
Bent moderator

@Brendan @Bent To the Suns for 18 targeting someone like Kyle Anderson, perhaps?  Presumably giving up 34 in the deal?


Definitely looking to get into the first round somehow, I think.



Brendan
Brendan

@Bent And this lets them keep Shump, so I'm cool with that. Trying to think of teams that make sense and would want this package and have the space, Toronto has the room and might be looking to bolster their back line? 

Brendan
Brendan

@Bent I'm sure, but they couldn't get him with the home court advantage already, it makes me think he's ready to move on. He's awesome and I think he could be really good in Phil's offense, but I'm preparing for life without him until some rumor starts pointing him back towards MSG. If he really is set on leaving, I'm down for a sign-and-trade. 

BDarc23
BDarc23

@Brendan

Shump has no place to play. JR Smith and Hardaway will take all the SG minutes. He sucks as SF. Might as well get a pick or cap space if you include him in a deal.

Bent
Bent moderator

@Brendan @Bent Maybe they still get rid of Shump and enter with two first rounders...or package those two and acquire a lottery pick.

a57se
a57se

@Brendan @Bent 

I don't think Melo is a good enough passer to play in any system other then everyone stand around and watch him try and score.

juunit
juunit

@BDarc23 

Smith and Hardaway are redundant though. At least Shump does something different in playing good D. I'd rather trade Smith out of all of them. 

Brendan
Brendan

@BDarc23 I think Shump could handle the "sit int he corner and shoot 3's" role. 

Brendan
Brendan

@a57se Like Bent said, the triangle can accommodate that type of player, and in some cases needs one to thrive. 


It'd give Melo touches all the time like he likes and open up opportunities for other guys. It'd be an improvement over last year's "Melo bring it up, melo drive or iso" every time while guys clear out or try to set sloppy picks for him. 

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Brendan @Bent That kind of offense is not that far removed from the MJ triangle.  It used to lead to isolations for him all the time.

BDarc23
BDarc23

Ok, but Smith is way better than Shump but he is crazy so no one wants him

BDarc23
BDarc23

@Brendan

What player will be on the bench? Shump isn't a good shooter either.

juunit
juunit

@BDarc23 

Is he better though? He loses so many games by shooting 30% and taking 25 shots. People never seem to factor in just how negative his contributions are half the time. 

Bent
Bent moderator

@BDarc23 I'd much prefer Shump because I'd rather have a good defensive player with some offensive ability than a good offensive player with no defensive ability.

juunit
juunit

@Brendan @juunit 

And I remember the days when people were trying to convince me that his contract was good because it's cheap for a guy who can score like that.

Brendan
Brendan

@BDarc23 He's better when he can set his feet and isn't running around picks. 


I think Hardaway probably starts coming off the bench if all three are on the roster. If one is traded, though, it's 100% Shump. 

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent @Brendan Yes, and maybe that's the flaw in the plan.  Right now he's as close as you're going to get though, because the guys who are on that level (and let's face it, nobody is really) are not available.

Brendan
Brendan

@a57se Melo is one of the most gifted offensive players in the NBA, though. In this instance, you can compare the two. 1v1, there are few players in the league as difficult to stop than Melo. 

BDarc23
BDarc23

@juunit

He had a terrible 1st half of the season coming off injury but he avg'd 18ppg the year before and won 6th man of the year. He also does defend so I'm not sure where that is coming from. He isn't Shump 2011 on D but he is ok.

BDarc23
BDarc23

@Bent

Shump hasn't been good on offense. He was ok his rookie year but has not improved at all. He was under 40% again last year. His defense wasn't as good last year either imo

Brendan
Brendan

@Bent Shump can continue to build an offensive game, he's athletic and showed an increasing ability to drive last year. I'm more bullish than most, but I think he can be a very competent offensive player as he matures. 


Smith can't build himself a brain that makes him try all the time and play defense and not have meltdowns in the middle of games. But I would miss him tweeting photos of big 'ol booties and stories about him trying to "lay the pipe" to underage girls on Twitter. 

juunit
juunit

@BDarc23 

He gambles too much. Every part of his game is feast or famine. He goes for a steal, doesn't get it, then the guy has an open lane for a layup. 

bklyndude
bklyndude

@Brendan @Bent

I think Woodson screwed Shumpert a bit last year with some head games.  I was looking forward to Shumpert having a great season and building off his great playoff run where he flashed his talents.  

I would love to see him get another year but I think Phil and Derek have made decisions about which players they want going forward and all others are being moved.  The demolition and rebuilding has begun.

Brendan
Brendan

@bklyndude And I'm fine with the fact that they're making their moves now, it shows they have direction and a plan. But I'm with you, I'd love to see Shump get one more year. 

bklyndude
bklyndude

@Brendan @bklyndude

It looks similar to Idizk's first year,  get the salary cap into a very good position heading into 2015 - the second year - and look for some solid veteran players and acquire draft picks for the current season.

I think Phil told Carmelo the Knicks are rebuilding this year and to go see what's out there for him,  but he is welcome back in New York if that's what's best for him,  no hard feelings either way.   

Bent
Bent moderator

@a57se @Bent @BDarc23 Smith actually averaged 1.5 last year and Shump only 1.1.  Neither of them are Giradi-esque though.