Link: Johnny was never an option

While Johnny Manziel was available for the Jets at the 18th pick, was he an option for the Jets? Rich Cimini writes about it on ESPN NY:

Johnny Manziel never was a consideration for the Jets with the 18th pick. Never. Their target was safety Calvin Pryor. When the Baltimore Ravens selected lineback C.J. Mosley at 17, the Jets’ draft room “erupted,” general manager John Idzik said in a radio interview. They were ecstatic because they thought the Ravens might take Pryor. Unlike the Dallas Cowboys, the Jets didn’t have a Manziel discussion when they were on the clock. They simply didn’t buy into Johnny Football, according to a person familiar with the team’s thinking. No doubt, there were non-football reasons as well. Idzik wasn’t going to buy a ticket to that circus, no way. The Jets are happy with Pryor. They believe he’s smart enough to quarterback the secondary as a rookie. Rex Ryan always talks up his rookies, but he’s particularly smitten with Pryor.

Brian Bassett, TheJetsBlog.com

Unless the Jets were sold out on Manziel, it would have been hard to bring him into the fray with Geno Smith and Mike Vick.  Vick might still be a better quarterback, but his window is closing.  Geno Smith had a bumpy first season, but showed promise at the end of last year.  While Geno demonstrated a lot of room for growth, he did enough in December to earn another shot over bringing in someone like Johnny Manziel.

As far as the true object of the Jets affection?  It sounds as if the Jets had Pryor ranked well above where he landed with the Jets at 18.  So far under GM John Idzik, the Jets now have picked three first rounders in the last two drafts and all of them “slid” to the Jets.  All three could be mainstays of this team for years to come.




220 comments
bradysucks
bradysucks

I've gotta admit that I am excited to see the Jets new look offense in action

The past 2 years have been painful

I'm feeling much better about things

By the way....I am convinced Manziel will be a huge success in Clevland

(Ducks)

tsjc68
tsjc68

@bradysucks  While I still think that Geno will be a better NFL QB than Johnny Football, even if I'm wrong and Geno ends up an irredeemable bust, I'd rather have Pryor and Tajh Boyd (or any one of about 20 other non-Manziel options at R1#18 and Tajh Boyd) and kick the franchise QB can down the road until 2015, where we'd have other options all more palatable than short, erratic Johnny Football (like Brett Hundley, Marcus Mariota, Jameis Winston, Kevin Hogan, Bryce Petty, Chuckie Keeton, Taylor Kelly, Shane Carden, and others.)

a57se
a57se

@bradysucks  

I am with you bradysucks......this offense is gonna put some points on the board!!!

It will free rex' defense to just pin their ears back and make life he$$ for opposing QB's!

bradysucks
bradysucks

Well Pryor is great...I'm already a big fan

Manziel was the guy I would have picked but Pryor is hard not to love. He seems Revis like to me - supremely talented, smart, hard working, and confident in his game. Wouldn't surprise me if Pryor makes all pro as a rookie in Rex's defense

bradysucks
bradysucks

An NFL team that can't score points in today's game is just a disaster

Thank God they finally started addressing this with the Jets

Idzik seems to "get it"

a57se
a57se

@bradysucks  

I thought you were talking about Terrelle Pryor at first.....:)

bradysucks
bradysucks

@Bent @Bytor @bradysucks  


Cold blooded Bent!!


That was cold blooded!!!


People rub in me liking Weeden....Nobody gives me credit for liking Russell Wilson.....


cold blooded


lol

miamijoe
miamijoe

@a57se @bradysucks  I agree with you.  Say what you want about any part of Rex as a coach, but he does know talent and how to coach it.  Unless you are faux talent like VG who robbed that bank and will be working at WalMart when the bonus runs out.

Bytor
Bytor

@Bent @Bytor @bradysucks  I personally don't get the INTENSE man-crushes some posters get on players. Someone pointing out some shortcoming (pun intended) of Brandin Cooks didn't get my panties in a bunch. And now drafted by NO I've moved on.

Bent
Bent moderator

@Bytor @bradysucks  That's the only thing that prevented BS's last binkie (Brandon Weeden) from being a Hall of Famer!

Bytor
Bytor

@bradysucks  Manziel went to Cleveland. What in God's green earth makes you think he'll succeed there? It's flippin' Cleveland as in the Browns. 

tsjc68
tsjc68

@bradysucks  We'll see.


Just stop pretending like there's some line of demarcation between "project players" and "ready to contribute immediately" players.


Or that we only pick the former while the rest of the league keeps picking the latter.



Brendan
Brendan

@bradysucks  Are the Browns selling jerseys with that on the back? Because they should. 

bradysucks
bradysucks

U mean Johnny F'in Awesome?

Fixed that for ya

tsjc68
tsjc68

@bradysucks  Again, the fact that we swung and missed on Hill (if that proves to be the case) still does not mean we should take an organizational stance against drafting developmental project guys who are not 100% NFL ready from jumpstreet in the early rounds ever again.


And it's hilarious that you're excoriating the team for drafting a raw project player with upside named Stephen Hill at #43 overall in the same breath that you advocate for spending the #18 pick on JOHNNY FREAKING IMPROVISATIONAL COMEDY.


Johnny Manziel is a project player, bradysucks.

Brendan
Brendan

@bradysucks  That's not an actual saying, even though it kind of sounds like one. 

bradysucks
bradysucks

One man's awful logic is another man's insightful proclamation

I am on the record saying Pryor and Manziel will be very good...maybe not as rookies but I wouldn't be surprised if they were good from the get go

bradysucks
bradysucks

Take a look at the WR's in that draft we passed on to take Hill...

I got no problem with trading up....but the Jets didn't do their homework

bradysucks
bradysucks

Patterson contributed tremendously on special teams...

Checkmate?

Nice try

Hahaha

tsjc68
tsjc68

@bradysucks  


You may not have seen Austin as a project, but he was.  All 5'8" guys are projects.  Jalen Saunders is a project as well.


Also, Tavon Austin didn't exactly light the world on fire in St. Louis last year.  His numbers were in the Jeremy Kerley stratosphere (THE HORRORS!!!).  Ditto Cordarelle.


Doesn't mean they won't be good eventually, but they are not NFL-ready "plug and play" guys like you always made them out to be.


-------------


You're using confirmation bias to assume that Hill and Vlad were riskier than all the other early-round guys taken by other clubs, and that's just not true.  They were risky picks, but ALL picks are risky in one way or another, and other picks with similar risk patterns to those two guys (specifically, world-class athleticism but questionable competition levels and lack of pro-style polish) have been successful.  


Our gambles just haven't worked.  Doesn't mean that gambling in this fashion is unwise.

levi
levi

@bradysucks  Pryor aint going all pro until he grows out a gnarly beard!!  And that takes time.

Brendan
Brendan

@bradysucks But Patterson didn't even have 500 yards receiving! 


#Checkmate

bradysucks
bradysucks

I didn't see Tavon Austin as a project

I also was just as enthusiastic about Cordarelle Patterson a year ago and Patterson had a very good rookie year

Austin would have helped the Jets and Austin is much more NFL ready than Hill or Vlad who were both HUGE projects

tsjc68
tsjc68

@bradysucks  


I am not a believer in using early round picks on project players unless that player is a QB.


And yet, not even a year ago, you advocated drafting Tavon Austin at #9 overall.


Also, I have a feeling you'd be totally okay with spending an early-round pick on Randall Cobb or Dontari Poe or Torrey Smith or Jason Pierre-Paul or Bobby Wagner, all of whom were most definitely raw "projects" who came into the league with tons of raw upside but considerable question marks.


You don't like taking raw project-players because the ones we've taken haven't panned out.  Had we taken some and hit big on them, perhaps you'd feel differently about things.

bradysucks
bradysucks

I agree that it isn't likely to be all pro as a rookie....but I think Pryor gets there if he stays healthy and remains focused

bradysucks
bradysucks

I see Pryor having a more successful rookie year than Big Mo or Coples

I think Pryor has a high football IQ and the talent to make the most of that high football IQ. I also think he is blessed to be coached by Rex and have a dominant d-line pressuring the QB

tsjc68
tsjc68

@bradysucks  "having success as a rookie" is a much more reasonable bar to clear than "instantly being one of the three best players at his position in the entire league".


All-Pro is rarified are, and as __fense notes below, Richardson and Allen (and even Mo Wilkerson) were not All-Pros as rookies.

bradysucks
bradysucks

I am not a believer in using early round picks on project players unless that player is a QB. Even then I'd draft a QB with the intent of starting him after a redshirt year

bradysucks
bradysucks

You are right that the odds are against Pryor being all pro as a rookie. I do think he will get there though if he stays healthy. I can easily see Pryor having success as a rookie just like Boss Hogg and Keenan Allen etc

tsjc68
tsjc68

@bradysucks  Sure, but the problem is, you complain about said guy continuing to get chances while not acknowledging that the team knows he's struggling, knew he might struggle (since he was raw) and took steps to hedge their bets.


The key difference between Sanchez and HIll/Ducasse is, with Hill/Ducasse, the team took steps to bring in alternatives to force Hill/Ducasse to earn their keep.


We gambled on the upside, but didn't put all our eggs in one basket when the upside didn't immediately materialize.  You should be happy about that.

Brendan
Brendan

@bradysucks  That's very different than saying "he'll be an all-pro." 


I think most fans would agree that if a 1st round pick isn't starting games and playing well by Y4 the team shouldn't keep hoping the light goes on. 

bradysucks
bradysucks

It is what it is....

But at some point it makes sense to cut your losses....

Not everybody is gonna be a success....That is just life. If a guy isn't the undisputed starter within 3 or 4 years of being drafted it speaks volumes (at least to me)

Brendan
Brendan

@bradysucks  All rookies struggle. 


I'm bullish on his career as a whole, but he's still a rookie. He'll make plays that get us all pumped up, but he'll still make some rookie mistakes. Even Revis wasn't Revis Island as a rookie. 

tsjc68
tsjc68

@bradysucks  


"I don't like waiting years and years for early round picks to develop"


It is what it is.

bradysucks
bradysucks

I think Pryor won't struggle as a rookie

Rex seems to think he is a quick study also

levi
levi

@bradysucks  It will take him time to learn Rex's complex system. Especially since he said Pryor will be the man calling it. I fear there will be many growing pains.

Brendan
Brendan

@bradysucks  It is extreme to say any rookie will be an all-pro in his rookie year, BS. 

bradysucks
bradysucks

I have opinions

I don't know if it is extreme to say Pryor could be all pro. He already has an NFL body and he hits like a freight train. The ball skills are there and Rex will set him up for success

I am a passionate fan no doubt..,,I have strong opinons about who can and can't play...

I don't like waiting years and years for early round picks to develop

a57se
a57se

@bradysucks  

You can not challenge rexy when it comes to talent evaluation.....he knows his stuff!

Brendan
Brendan

@bradysucks  Haha all-pro!? 


Like I said last week, BS, you are a man of extremes. All or nothing, just don't hold it against Pryor if he doesn't crack the AP team this year. 

tsjc68
tsjc68

@bradysucks  Yeah, Pryor wasn't my favorite choice at #18, but it's hard to deny the upside, and Rex's personal seal of approval for him means a lot, Rex is practically flawless in spotting elite defensive talent.

tsjc68
tsjc68

@Brendan @jaygo  I like how we've re-christened 57 as a high-octane, attractive woman spouting nonsense.